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So What? Marketing Analytics and Insights Live

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In this week’s episode of So What? we focus on your sales funnel. We walk through what metrics to pay attention to, how to determine if it’s working, and solutions to improve it. Catch the replay here:

In this episode you’ll learn: 

  • How to set it up
  • Analyzing what’s working
  • Steps to improve your conversion rates

Upcoming Episodes:

  • Video SEO – TBD
  • How do you benchmark a website’s performance? – TBD


Have a question or topic you’d like to see us cover? Reach out here:

AI-Generated Transcript:

Katie Robbert 0:42
Hey, so Happy Thursday. Welcome to so what the marketing analytics and insights live show you are live with myself and John Wall Chris is participating in marketingprofs B2B today. And so John and i decided that we were going to cover the sales funnel, so dissecting the sales funnel. Now, John, this is something you know, because you do a lot of sales and bizdev, you know quite a bit about and when I was doing my homework to sort of get reoriented to the sales funnel, I realized there’s a lot of different ways to think about a sales funnel, you can do a sales funnel that’s contained, specifically within a CRM, you can do a blend of data. Where do you want to start?

John Wall 1:25
Yeah, that’s really a great question. Because it’s funny. I mean, I appreciate you saying, like, I’ve done this a long time. But then by the same side of it, there’s days where I’m like, well, like, none of it really matters. Because you’re building everything from scratch almost, with every organization you jump into, and you make so much of it up as you go. I think a good dividing line is, you know, what are you trying to do, and at one side of it is as a sales tool, you know, the sales manager wants to know what the sales team is doing. And so knowing if you’ve got enough, you know, moving along, to be able to be where you want to be. So that’s one big bucket. And then the other big bucket is the marketing, then of, you know, okay, are the stuff we’re doing on marketing, like what out there is actually getting stuff so that the sales people can talk to it. So those tend to be the two buckets. But yeah, it can be all over the place. The other thing is, it’s kind of easier to just say B2B versus B2C. But it’s kind of gray and murky, but you do have these two camps of on one side, you know, you have so many transactions, that the data is always fantastic. And that the other end is kind of the classic B2B tech startup where, you know, you have so little data that you know, you’re doing it just because you want to keep track of what’s going on, but it can rarely predict for you. And it’s kind of a challenge. So those are the two, two bends. But yeah, and then tying it to CX, this is all thing to what have you got with this here.

Katie Robbert 2:44
So the way that I tend to think about my sales funnel is the blend of marketing and sales data. And so this is sort of how I keep it straight, in my mind is to use that example of the customer experience. So awareness, consideration, evaluation, and purchase. So if I just think about the first four phases of the customer experience, then to me that says, I don’t necessarily have enough data in my CRM alone, to answer the question of what my customer journey looks like. And so that’s the way that I think about it. Now, the other. The other example, that you were talking about, John is purely, you know, looking at just your sales data. And so this is an example of our sales funnel using just our CRM data. So you have all deals created. So essentially, awareness, leads opportunities to proposals closed one and last. And, you know, this is something that we can customize, so we can break it down to contacts and prospects. So it just a really, to your point, it depends on what it is you’re trying to accomplish. And I guess sort of be like, which masters? Are you trying to serve? Like, who? Who are you trying to answer the question for so if you’re just working purely with the sales team, just your CRM data might be fine. But if you were also working with the marketing team, and the marketing team is responsible for some of this, then you probably want some sort of a blend of the marketing and the sales data.

John Wall 4:24
Yeah, and I think another thing that gets underestimated is that the landscape has changed so much that you have to take this approach that you’ve done here, because, you know, back after dinosaurs, dinosaurs roamed the earth, but you know, before internet was everything, it used to be that the sales team controlled the whole buying cycle, like if you want to buy something, the only way to do it and learn about it was to talk to a salesperson, but now with many transactions, you know, 90% of the research and the decision was made before they even engage with sales. So you’ve got to get that marketing vision, you know, see what’s going on earlier in the cycle because, yeah, it’s it’s way too late by the time it’s the first time Sky.

Katie Robbert 5:01
I agree with that. And so what I’ve set up for ourselves and so this is this is sort of where I wanted to start today was, you know, where do you start with thinking about your sales funnel, and again, you can pull directly out of your CRM, a lot of them have it built in, like, I used to use Salesforce at a previous job. And they had this really nice visual of, you know, the funnel, literally, like the widest part of the top moving all the way down to the smallest part of us part out and they have sort of the same kind of visual and you know, John, I know in your notes, you were sort of talking about that champagne glass funnel?

John Wall 5:40
Yeah, it actually I totally screwed that up. It’s really martini glass is?

Katie Robbert 5:45
Oh, sorry. I screwed it up. I called it the wrong thing.

John Wall 5:48
Well, no, no, because I wrote champagne in the notes. I was thinking, I don’t know why I never choose champagne over Martini. So I. But the big thing is, yeah, you totally nailed that of the good looking graphs, right? That’s just totally what all these SaaS CRM and marketing automation systems sell. They’re like, Hey, Mr. CEO, you know, look, you’re just gonna wake up on your yacht in the morning and look at this colorful dashboard, and everything’s gonna be awesome. But the reality of those is, so many of the sales funnels, it doesn’t have this, like, everybody would love it to have like a 20, attend to 30% step on every, you know, move through the funnel. And the reality is, in a lot of funnels, you know, you’re doing such mass broadcasting that, you know, one in 10,000 is okay, I mean, it’s gonna blow your percentages out, and your graph is gonna look weird. But that’s those are the kind of numbers that you can’t be afraid of, you know, with your sales process, because, you know, the whole world can come grab your freemium thing. But you know, the folks that actually have the money to buy the product is a much smaller end of it. But that doesn’t mean that you ignore those people at all, you need to have every one of those people out there, because the more mindshare, you have an awareness you have that does eventually make it down through the funnel, it’s just not going to be as pretty as you want it to look.

Katie Robbert 7:00
That’s right. And so one of the ways that I’ve started to look at it, and this tells me a lot about what we have going on. So this spreadsheet is my whole all of the metrics that I keep. But what I have off to the side, which you can’t see, all of the other metrics is I’m looking at the funnel in terms of, here’s the audience, here’s the awareness. So if you think back to, you know, that customer journey, customer experience map is sort of the awareness first, and then consideration evaluation purchase. So the way that I’ve put those together in here is so people coming to the website, so you know, GA users, that’s my website, visitors, that is the awareness first. And then if from my website, they fill out a form, that to me is that consideration that’s like that additional engagement of, okay, I’ve been to your site, I kind of like the stuff that you do. Therefore, I’m going to take the time to give you my contact information, knowing that I’m going into your database and do something. And then from there, we have the leads, and those are the people who from the prospects, say, you know, what, I’m interested in what you’re selling. Let’s go ahead and talk about what that looks like. And then from there, once they’ve raised their hand and said, I want to, you know, I’m interested, okay, why don’t you go ahead and send me a proposal. And that’s the deals and then from there, we want to see of those, how many, how many we close, and how many we don’t. And so it’s a very simplistic funnel, but we’re also a super small company, and our sales cycles aren’t, aren’t that long, they, you know, can go anywhere from a couple of days to about a month. And so really trying to focus in on the metrics that matter. And so when I look at this, you know, I have my percentages of what is that conversion look like? So we have a really good conversion rate from people who come to the website, and actually do something and fill out a form where we tend to break down and this, you know, is something that we’ve been talking about for a while is that step in between prospects and leads, and so going from consideration to evaluation in that customer journey. What the heck do we do, because people are interested in downloading, you know, original research or signing up for the newsletter. But they, that’s sort of where it stops. And so that’s where our lowest conversion rate is. It’s point 13%, which is really, really, really low. It’s not even a 1% conversion. And so that’s where our funnel is broken. However, once we get people to raise their hand and say, Yes, I’m interested in your services, our conversion rates tend to go up again. So the people who you know are more serious, who have budget have authority, they go into the deals and once we actually put a proposal in front of someone, we have a really good win rate. I mean, this right here, says 100% I highly doubt that it’s truly 100% But for the sake of argument, let’s go ahead and say that it is. And so this is a really simplistic sales funnel. But this tells me a lot of information. And it tells me that this section in here, between prospects and leads, is broken.

John Wall 10:15
Yeah, that’s there. I mean, from having seen similar funnels and played with the funnels, like, I wouldn’t be horrified at that, unless that point one three was less than, like point oh, six. I mean, that’s really, because we used to use a p factor, which was, you know, percentage divided by 1000. Because there’s such a huge leap there in that, at that one step there, because you know, you’ve got Okay, so anybody that wants to download free research, that’s everybody. But now you look at our product. I mean, think about the fact that our product is really only for enlightened marketers, right? I mean, it’s for marketers that want to know what’s going on, right? We’ve all worked with these marketers, they just want to spend their ad money and never have management, ask them where it’s going. So, you know, really, you say that look, only about a third of that audience is even bold enough to be a customer, and then still, you know, then you get into that 1/3, they’ve got to have budget, you know, the authority to sign a check need is usually always there timeline is one, we see a lot of these projects where they sit around forever. But yeah, what that’s the whole band thing. We have budget authority need timeline, that’s it if they got all four of those than that. And the thing is, and like you see it with the win rate is there. I mean, if they make it to the point where we’ve had three or four conversations, and they have the full band, then it’s pretty much a done deal. And then there’s that whole sales process thing of by the time they get to that meeting, they’ve invested so much time and effort that they have to get something done, like they can’t walk away. That’s actually what the sales guys favorite part of it, where you’ve got to have invested enough that you know that something’s going to happen, because they, they can’t go back to their boss and say they just throw in the towel.

Katie Robbert 11:54
So then this brings us to what the heck do we do about this. And so I wanted to show a couple of examples, you know, just to sort of draw the comparison between attribution modeling and actual digital customer journey map, because we talk about them a little bit, you know, interchangeably. And so when we talk about digital customer journey mapping, where we are talking about attribution modeling, but we’re talking about it in different contexts. And so you can do attribution modeling, in Google Analytics, you know, so you have this attribution project. So this is really helpful for you to understand, you know, that multi step conversion path of what does it take for someone to actually take action on your website, the problem is, at least in this respect, that’s where it ends, you don’t actually get the data around the leads, and you don’t get the data around, you know, the deals and the sales. And so that’s problematic. And then we also, then when we look at a more advanced version, this is the attribution model for Trust Insights. For for March, when we take a look at the importance of each channel, we have email, and social and organic, those are the channels that are helping people convert. But again, that doesn’t really tell me what do I do about that one step in my funnel, that feels like it’s not working. So that’s where this particular report comes in. Let me see if I can make this a little bit bigger. Okay. So this is actually, you can see down here, and again, this is the same type of attribution model, but we were looking at it a little bit differently. And so this is for Trust Insights. This is from our so we have awareness, engagement and conversion. So the basic steps of the customer journey. And what I’m seeing here, right smack in the middle are the things that I need to be thinking about. Are they the channels that are in the right place? And are they helping me convert people from prospects to actual leads. And so the way that you read an analysis like this, and again, we know that we are not designers, we know that we, you know, still struggle with sort of the UX of things. We are the data, folks, and we’re gonna give you really good interesting data. But it might not be super pretty. So we were aware of that shout out to Pete Bueller, who’s helping us, you know, fix that problem. God love Pete. So what we can see up here though, is that marketing over coffee, John, that’s your website that helps with the awareness, Elegant Themes, business wire, being organic, and all of these things up here are what are driving awareness. So that’s what’s making people aware. And that’s what’s driving the traffic to the website. But then when we start to move a little bit down the list we have, we did a little bit of CPC a couple of months ago, we have LinkedIn and then we have some email that’s doing the lifting of getting people from that phase of I’m aware of you to I want to actually download something. And then as you keep moving down, it follows those steps in the customer journey. And so what John, we need to think about is, are the right channels in the right places, if that part of the funnel is still kind of broken? I mean, what do you what do you do with an analysis like this?

John Wall 15:29
Yeah, that’s because, you know, normally the classic funnel, you’ll see people counsel, you as far as you know, it should have lower lift and lower trades at the top, you know, it should be website visits and download a paper. And then the time commitments and the effort go up. So that, you know, as you get around buying time, they should be watching customer demos and customer testimonial videos and heavier stuff. And we see a lot of that that’s, you know, dead on, you’ve got like the email newsletters right at the middle. And that’s a big thing for us. Unfortunately, we’re not just, you know, grab it off the shelf product kind of company, people need to know who we are, and work with us to understand what’s going on. So there’s personal touch at that stage. Like, that’s just the big one, if people are wanting to take the time to get in front of us and talk through their process. That’s where it moves. You know, the Google organic is actually really impressive there. And the fact that, you know, a lot of the clients that we work with Google organic, can be up to 80% of their traffic. I mean, they’re out there, basically. And they will change their mind One morning, their business would get wiped out. And so it’s all over the place. Yeah, I don’t know, your social channels, I think are kind of surprisingly small. Given the amount of speaking that we do and that kind of stuff, I’d expect to see those dots to be a little bit bigger. And yeah, I think, you know, another thing with this is one angle is to look at this one month over another and see what things have moved based on the programs we’ve tried and things we’ve, you know, done. Like it’s been interesting, the, you know, the almost timely newsletters and all that stuff, for some reason shows up later in the cycle, I would expect that to be earlier in the cycle that people would jump in on offers and audits and things like that, but it doesn’t show up. So do we need to do a better job of the comp copy? Or do we need to do you know, one off emails where we just send an offer, it’s not buried in the copy of the newsletter, those are a couple things that could be kicked around or tried. But yeah, it’s really just a matter of kind of cherry picking, you know, use the data to guide your gut as to what you want to test and then actually start playing with some stuff.

Katie Robbert 17:31
Well, and I think that that’s exactly it. And so you’re hitting upon something really important that when you have an analysis like this, you can start to reframe what you’re thinking about. And so, you know, you called out the example of the almost timely newsletter, and so the offers that are in that newsletter, that bring people to our site to get them to take action to buy something, maybe the way that it’s messaged is wrong, maybe it’s messaged in such a way that it’s, Hey, have you ever heard of us, here’s an introductory thing, when really, someone’s looking for the Buy Now button. And so that would be something that we would want to test. You know, you also called out Google organic, which is our SEO, for a lot of our clients, we actually see SEO, up at the top of the funnel with the awareness. So people who are, you know, searching for specific terms might come across, you know, that particular company, but the way that our audience is using SEO, is they’re already aware of us, they’re looking for something specific that we do, so that they can come to our website and take action. So they’re looking for a research there, they became aware of us, you know, through some other method, like Facebook or like LinkedIn, and they want to go directly to our site to find the thing or to find the type of service. We do see a lot of email in here, we have a lot of different email assets. And so there we may be, we’re using them incorrectly, maybe we have them positioned wrong, maybe we’re sending them to the wrong segments of the audience. I mean, these are all things that, you know, as the person responsible, ultimately, for the company, I’m like, Well, what the heck do I do to bring more people in to get them excited about buying something from us?

John Wall 19:22
Yeah, that’s just always a challenge. Now, it’s, you know, it’s an every business struggles, especially, I mean, for us, it’s not even as bad as some of these freemium companies. I mean, where you’ve got 1000s of accounts set up, and you’re only a trickle of it actually goes through the business, but you need it there for validation. And it’s interesting for us, because that doesn’t apply to us at all right? getting additional business early on some kind of trial basis, does nothing for us to improve our process or two, you know, it’s not like by having 10,000 users pound on your platform, you actually make it more solid and there’s a lot of benefit provided to your paying customers. Whereas for us, you know, non paying Customers are just a distraction and a drain. So we have to be more judicious about that. And ROI can’t be just giving stuff away for free, we have to draw the line. But then on the other side of that is it does, it draws a hard line early upfront, as far as, have you got some budget, you know, I mean, if you’re gonna be writing for free all the time, don’t even bother to come hang around, because you know, you’re not going to get anything worth your time.

Katie Robbert 20:23
So let’s take a different angle at this, John. So let’s say so obviously, we provide that digital customer journey mapping service, you know, we provide that to our customers, we do it as one off projects. But let’s say you’re a marketer, or you’re a salesperson who doesn’t have access to that kind of data, in your experience, what are some of the techniques that you’ve used to, I guess, close the gap on some of these steps between, you know, prospect and lead or between audience and prospects? What are some of the techniques that marketers and sales folks should be thinking about? If they don’t have access to that customer journey map?

John Wall 21:04
Yeah, I mean, you could, there’s still stuff that you can do from the sales side of things. It’s very simple, right? I mean, they’re just looking at what makes things close, faster, better, and give me more right that that’s very easy to feed. And to keep it the marketing side is the challenging one of you having to work that balance of Okay, what do we actually throw over to the sales guys, to the sales team. And because there’s, in fact, a lot of this space here, it’s our sales gals that are doing better than the sales guys. But you know, what, it’s the criteria that we throw it over the wall to them, so that they can go play around with it. And then you as a, as a marketer have to, you know, all good marketers understand that you do have to have like a, you know, maybe a 18 to 24 month window of doing awareness campaigns, like, you can’t just say, okay, everything is going to be direct marketing. And it’s like, set up a demo today, you do need to do some just branding of getting your name out there and being at events, so that when people do you know, a year later reach that buying decision, they know who to go to, because I’ve seen a lot of studies with that, as far as if you throw everything onto the lead generation side, you just don’t get the, you know, the pipeline will eventually dry up. Unless your product has some kind of viral component into it, where people are getting paid to spread it around. You know, you’ve got to constantly be working at awareness and just getting in front of people. So but yeah, so for the sales guys, again to it’s not only is it simple criteria, but it’s also simple to all right, every CRM has the ability to show you like where the deals were, how much they closed for you, even if it’s just a single source code, so you know what the last touch was before they were thrown over the wall. And then, for marketing, though, it is a little bit weirder. There’s two checkpoints you’ve got to watch, you’ve got to watch that, you know, okay, when do we push it to sales? Like At what point is it worth going to sales, and then post close is the other thing because your stats really get screwed up as a marketer, once it gets thrown over to the sales team? Because you can’t trust that data anymore, right? Because every salesperson is different. And you’ll be able to see some are better than others. And unless, unless you have all the data, you can’t do an analysis on. Okay, these deals come in great. But you know, can only the good sales people close them, the bad ones can’t do it. Like what’s the, you’ve got a human factor that screws it all up. But you do also need to go and look and say, Okay, let’s take all the closed stuff and the loss stuff, and balance that back against the wins and losses in the spend and where it’s going because this is convoluted. But the example is, let’s say okay, you’re saying trade shows are great, and you’re going to get 500 leads for the sales guys, if they only close to or close none of those. That’s way more terrible than if you were just to only get them 10 leads this month, but they close five of them. You know, so there’s this balancing act of just getting raw leads in front of the salespeople is not as good as if they’re qualified and you know, ready to buy. So you have that to juggle where you can’t just go for run numbers, if you’ve got to have a quality factor in there somewhere. And you’re not going to know what that quality factor is until after you’ve run through, you know, three or four of your sales cycle. So yeah, it’s a it’s a never ending thing. But, you know, for marketers, again, it’s do the branding, and then do some direct marketing, see how many you can push to sales, and then sales just needs to do their thing and see how many they can get closed?

Katie Robbert 24:32
I think you bring up a really interesting point, having been on both sides of the conversation. I know that I’ve definitely gotten pressure from my sales teams in previous jobs, to give them more leads, give them more quality leads to give them more at bats and more people to call and more people to email. And as a marketer, it’s like, okay, I can get you all the people but if they’re not the people that you want, you need to give me more information around what that call defied lead looks like and how do I go after that. And so there’s definitely that conversation that needs to be had. And it needs to be more of a partnership with the sales and the marketing organizations and a lot of companies that structured that way. I remember when I was very, very green, and very early on in my career, my sales team was selling to a very, very tricky audience. And it was substance abuse counselors to use, you know, this tool, and they are some of the most overworked, underpaid, burnt out high turnover. And so I was able to source this master list of all of the main contacts across the United States, and I filled up the pipeline, and the sales guy looked at me, he goes, Well, there’s no email addresses. What do I do with this, I’m like, I guess you pick up the phone and call them. And he got really mad at me, because he wanted to just go ahead and just email everybody. And it was this huge disconnect of I thought I was doing him this really great service. But now on his side, I had messed up his data set, because it looks like he had all of these, you know, leads in the pipeline that he just wasn’t doing anything with. And I thought I was giving him all this great information. But he wanted it a certain way. And I couldn’t provide it, it just became this like source of tension, where I consistently couldn’t provide him the exact information that he wanted to, for him to feel like he was being set up for success. And, you know, it just it was one of those situations that nobody was going to win in. And I think that what I’ve learned from that is to really have those, you know, we’re I’m a broken record, but get those business requirements done, like really talk to the people and find out what’s the problem that you’re trying to solve? Even if it’s filling up your pipeline with leads? What is the type of information you need? Do you need to know their title? Do you need to know how big the company is? Do you need them to have an email address? Or as a phone number? Okay, maybe that information isn’t available publicly. So how do you get that information? And then you start testing those things within your, you know, marketing team and doing those A B tests with longer form shorter forms different demand Gen pieces, you know, do you give them a webinar? Do you give them a paper? Whatever the thing is, I mean, and it’s, you have to continually iterate and test, because not every user will have the same behavior. Not everybody will want to be contacted the same way.

John Wall 27:33
Yeah, no, that’s huge. So because you hit on a key point there of being able to communicate with the sales guy like that, that’s we find that organizational maturity and lack of bureaucracy are the primary factors, there was a VC firm here in Boston that did a bunch of research on I think it was over 2000 startups. And what they found was that it’s not how the funnel is set up. And where the turf is delineated. As far as this is marketing, and this is sales, there were organizations that ran the whole spectrum of marketing did everything and there was no salesman involvement at all. And so the reverse of it was always sales doing it, that actually never mattered. The most important factor is the ability of the people building the list to talk to the people doing the deals, and that they’re on the same page as far as what’s qualified and what works. And as long as that communication is there, the what the org structure looks like, is not a contributing factor to your ability to succeed. It’s all about your ability to communicate, and, and really the big win for the marketing people tend to really be like, Oh, you know, sales guys just sit on the lead, and they’re garbage. But the thing that I’ve seen work the most is when the marketing team rides along with sales and right, you know, takes the leads and goes and follows them through the entire sales process and sits with the salespeople and sees where the gaps are. And it’s truthful, you know, they get to see that, yeah, you know, the whole buyers are liars, and a lot of the leads are gonna be garbage. But the other thing is, they can go on the ride along and say, Oh, my God, you know, the sales guys don’t use, you know, these resources that we’ve made over here. And that’s just because, you know, in the pandemonium of the last year, nobody even bothered to tell them that they’re on the new intranet or whatever, like, you can find problems in the sales process that that work for everybody. And so yeah, that that whole human thing is, is the key factors to success.

Katie Robbert 29:26
It is. And so, you know, we’ve been talking about the sales funnel for, you know, about half an hour now droning on about, you know, where it’s broken, how to get people, you know, working together, but really what I wanted to accomplish sort of the so what of this? So what episode is that there are more advanced tools available for you to start to understand. If you’re in digital marketing, and you’re trying to feed that pipeline for your sales team or if you’re also responsible for sales. There are ways to be thinking about it and one of them is look Uh, you know, your digital customer journey analysis, whether it be by channel or whether it be by source medium and for us. We’re constantly looking at this data refining the messaging for each step of the process, you know. And so it makes sense that marketing over coffee, which is the podcast asset, is what’s introducing people to Trust Insights. It’s what it’s introducing people to the different services that we have. And so keeping that messaging consistent of, Hey, did you know that we’re also partnered with Trust Insights, Trust Insights, does the following five things. Whereas when someone’s trying to find out more about us on social, it should probably be a little bit more of something that they can actually take action with. So one of the things that Chris is doing today, as he’s speaking at marketing profs is he’s demonstrating our network graphing abilities by doing on Twitter, the network map of all of the speakers being talked about at marketingprofs. And so it’s an opportunity for people to engage with him to ask him questions, to look at more of it on our website and go, Oh, that’s really cool. I could use that for the show that I’m running. And then in our, in our emails, you know, we send out, you know, sales emails once a month, we do send out some deals in our email newsletters. So that’s where we should really be sort of driving the point home of, hey, here’s where you can buy the thing, go buy the thing, you’re aware of us, you signed up for our newsletter, therefore, you know, getting this email from us isn’t new information. So go buy something.

John Wall 31:36
always throw the Ask that’s it always be closing,

Katie Robbert 31:38
always be closing. So what do you think, John? What did we miss? What did we? What did we forget? No, I

John Wall 31:47
think we’re really solid here. I mean, because this is, you know, the idea is that, yeah, there’s this human component, and you’re off on a human adventure. But this is, these are the tools and the gear that you’re going to use out in the field. So, you know, are you going to go out there with a flashlight with dead batteries and a rusty knife? Or do you want to have you know, a tank in an army of 5000 points in the right direction. And yeah, it’s, you know, always gear up as much as you can afford to do because, you know, you, unfortunately, are always burned by time, right. So you can always throw more money and or raise more money. But, you know, if you can’t get the stuff close fast enough, that’s you’re going to run out of time, and you’re not going to make it so you’ve got to continue to drive and optimize as quick as you can. Because the payoff is what makes all the difference.

Katie Robbert 32:35
I agree. And so if you’re looking to get started with, you know, figuring out what your sales funnel look like, just start with the data that you have access to. So maybe it’s your website visits, maybe it’s the number of downloads of a certain piece, on your website, maybe it’s the number of people who have completed the Contact Us form. That’s a great place to start with understanding your funnel and then you can start to add on that sales data of number of leads, number of deals, number of wins, number of losses, and, you know, partner with your sales team to do that. Or if you have access to that, just pull it out of your CRM.

John Wall 33:12
That sounds good. Yeah. Go make a ruckus.

Katie Robbert 33:14
Go make a ruckus. And I think with that, John, we are wrapped up for this Thursday of So what?

John Wall 33:21
That sounds good. Have a good weekend, everybody.

Unknown Speaker 33:26
Thanks for watching today. Be sure to subscribe to our show wherever you’re watching it. For more resources. And to learn more, check out the Trust Insights podcast at Trust slash t i podcast, and a weekly email newsletter at Trust slash newsletter. got questions about what you saw on today’s episode. Join our free analytics for markers slack group at Trust slash analytics for marketers. See you next time.

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