{PODCAST} In-Ear Insights: 2022 Year In Review

In this week’s In-Ear Insights, Katie and Chris look back at the year that was. We looked at the impact of Twitter’s change in leadership and Google’s announcement that Universal Analytics is being discontinued. We also discussed the rise and fall of NFTs, Bitcoin and Web 3.0 technologies. We discussed the need to find a balance between being an early adopter of technology and a laggard. Finally, we discussed experiments that have been conducted to integrate OpenAI’s GPT-3 language model into tools, to help with content creation.

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Machine-Generated Transcript

What follows is an AI-generated transcript. The transcript may contain errors and is not a substitute for listening to the episode.

Christopher Penn 0:01

In this week’s In-Ear Insights Should old acquaintance be forgot.

We’re gonna look back at the year that was 2022.

Because this will be the last Trust Insights podcast until the new year.

And so we’ll, we’ll probably kick off the new year in January with something like, you know, New Year’s resolutions are planning or something along those lines.

But for now, let’s sit back with the beverage of your choice.

It’s eight morning, so it’s coffee here and talk about the year that was Katie, when you look back at the wild and crazy year, that was 2022.

What comes to mind? What did you learn what things took you by surprise? What stuff? Are you saying? Let’s let us never speak of this again.

Katie Robbert 0:43

You know, it’s funny, whenever I have conversations like this, the way that time moves is so liquid in a way of like, you know, when you look back and say, Oh, that was still this year, that was this year, that wasn’t 10 years ago.

And I can you know, a very specific example of that was, in 2020, the first year of the pandemic, I remember the Netflix TV show, Tiger King got released.

And by the time the end of the year, rolled around, we felt like we had all lived through about a decade.

And nobody could fathom and wrap their heads around the fact that tiger King had been released right before the pandemic of that same year, it felt like it had happened so long ago.

And so when I think about all the things that happened this year, in 2022, I’m struggling to really pinpoint like the big major things, I mean, the one that’s notable that we’re still experiencing right now, as we’re recording this podcast is the change in ownership of, you know, one of the world’s most popular social media platforms, Twitter, and so that in terms of businesses, and marketing, and customer support, and communication and communities, that change of leadership has had a huge impact.

And in some ways, it’s good.

In some ways, it’s bad.

It’s good in the sense that I think that for a lot of us, it has forced us to rethink how we make those connections online, it’s forced us to really explore and discover different paths for creating online communities.

Taking it a little bit more private.

Chris, you wrote about this in your private social media community paper, which I think was very timely, because we’re seeing day after day, people who have built homes on Twitter, it’s just falling apart brick by brick, and the more bricks that fall into the ocean, the more people are just like, Okay, I’m out, I’m gonna find a new place, you can find me over on post, you can find me over on Discord, you can find me on Mastodon, and it feels very disjointed.

Again, there’s no central meeting place anymore.

Christopher Penn 3:06


The one big one that stands out to me for this year that directly impacts us and our customers was March 17 2020.

To a day that will be noted for the sheer amount of panic caused when Google announced Universal Analytics is going away as of July 120 23.

A lot of folks thought we had more time, I thought we had more time last time, Google made a big change that was like a five year window for people to make a change from the ga.js script to the analytics.js script.

And this time, Universal Analytics, GA four came out in October 2020, we all just kind of forgot because you know, global pandemic, and just time went completely off the rails.

And so when that announcement came out, you know, a year and a half after GA four was live, we’re like, Wait, didn’t it just come out.

And so it has been a a struggle for many companies to even start talking about that planning, much less get it rolling, it doesn’t help that Google is still making substantial changes to the application.

As of last week, the entire configure screen moved into the admin panel, which is where it should have been the entire time.

One of our complaints early on was like there’s four places to configure this thing.

And, and they’ve just released changes to the underlying data model.

So that if you build a session in GA four, and then you look at the same data in Big Query, they’re different, they don’t match up.

So there’s still a lot of work to be done there.

But I know for 2022, even though that was like, did that happen this year? Like yes, this year was the year that Universal Analytics was given a tombstone,

Katie Robbert 4:44

you know, and it’s funny that you say that because in my head, I’m like, oh, no, that was totally last year.

And it’s one of those things that like, it just, it feels like it’s been going on forever.

So therefore, the fact that we’ve only been experiencing it first Seven months or so is very hard to wrap your head around.

You know, in terms of our business, you know, we, we’ve been fortunate to have another growth here, and we’re looking forward to growing even more next year.

And I think, you know, with that it’s, you know, there’s celebration to be had, but at the same time, at least for me, I feel even more pressure to continue to grow and build in a positive, sustainable way.

And so it’s really forced me as the CEO to reexamine how I’m doing that with the company, how I’m leading the company, how I’m able to grow the company, and it can’t be, you know, haphazard, you know, bubble gum and duct tape anymore.

Like, there has to be some real professionalism and processes, and, you know, standards and all of those things.

That’s not the part that’s overwhelming and scary.

It’s the pressure to get it right.

And, you know, knowing that mistakes happen, you know, you can bounce back from them.

But, you know, I personally moving into next year, I feel like the stakes are even higher.

And so I’m trying to manage my own expectations in terms of what we’re capable of making sure I’m, you know, playing it conservative, but also pushing us a bit more, because I know that we’re capable of more.

And so those are just for the business.

I’m hopeful that the the things that I can put in place will help us grow exponentially over the next couple of years.

Christopher Penn 6:50

And speaking of exponential, though, one of the biggest changes this year, that is, we’re only just starting to see the implications.

And it’s going to be a little wild as as the scope is revealed, was generative AI, generative AI with Stable Diffusion is launched in August, which seems like forever ago, but it was actually only just August, which is the open source image generation model that took the world by storm people doing all sorts of crazy stuff with visual imagery, winning art contests and stuff like that.

And then OpenAI is DaVinci model, which is part of the GPT-3 family.

It’s the GPT.

They call it GPT-3.

Point five now, and it’s text generation abilities.

The the new UI on the chat GPT interface that everyone was talking about, is just a chat interface on this large language model.

The language model has gotten so, so good, it has gotten incredibly good in the last iteration, and GPT, four is on the way.

And we are only now just beginning to see oh, this thing is actually good and bad.

I was helping a friend of mine on one of my Discord servers, they were saying they have to write up a paper about Raphael’s painting, School of Athens.

And like, I don’t know what to write it says, so let’s go to OpenAI playground and type in you know, write a 1500 word essay on the importance of the School of Athens by Raphael focusing on you know, this, that new thing, and it spit out a lovely essay, and they’re like, Wow, this is better than I could have right on the gas.

What not to do, you probably should fact check it to make to make sure it’s it’s coherent.

But that is the tip of the iceberg.

For what’s going to happen to marketing.

I mean, I’m playing with something right now, on my personal website.

I’ve never loved the copy on my speaking page.

I’m like, because it’s one of those things like unless you’re a complete narcissist, you don’t love writing about yourself, right? Like, hey, hire me.

And so I gave it a I gave the AI a draft of the outline like, here’s the cogent facts, turn this into a landing page copy, and it wrote up something.

So what I did was I made it a Google optimized test.

I said, Okay, here’s my original.

Here’s what the machine put out.

Let’s see, which we’ll see which one wins, names, conversions.

And I think this year was the year where this stuff went from being cute or interesting, or like a cool party trick to being Oh, this is going to substantially impact any business that deals with writing or imagery, period.

Katie Robbert 9:30

Speaking of things that we thought were going to have a big impact, and that were everywhere, all the time.

365 and fts.

Well, yeah, all the time.

And so when we started the year NFT this and after that, do you have your NF t? Let’s talk about NF TS does your business have an NF T? And it was just obnoxious.

And now You know, fast forward, people might still be talking about them, but not with the same, you know, vigor not with the same passion, not with the same in your face newness.

And, you know, I feel like the past couple of years.

I mean, it’s, it’s true of every year, there’s always those, you know, flash in the pan trends that people like, talk about, talk about talking about and then they die, and then you never hear about them again.

Now, I’m not saying that NF T’s aren’t still a thing.

But they’re just not taking up the conversation.

Like they were at the beginning of the year.

It’s the same with you know, clubhouse peaked, and then was gone.

And then you have you know, Bitcoin cryptocurrency, still things still exist, but just not as overwhelming.

And so I would put NFT in that, can we move on from that thing category.

Christopher Penn 10:54

And a big part of the reason was the absolute price crash, right.

So the crypto market basically collapsed in on itself.

For those who are listening only I’m showing a chart of from coin market cap of just bitcoins price, which started the year, around $50,000 per coin.

And as of today, as we wind down the, it’s hovering around $17,000, a coin, so in this year’s time, it has lost like 60% of its value.

And because it’s a financial system without regulation, which is by design, it’s it’s been a lot of the big players, a lot of the well known brands have kind of, you know, shattered into little pieces, a number of folks in the marketing space that we all know, had creator coins, right, these essentially sort of digital stocks, almost you could buy a share of Ann Handley coin, or mark Shaffer’s coin, or Joe Pilates coin.

And Scott, Monty is coin, and so on and so forth.

And they’ve all mostly gone away, because the underlying company, their coin is essentially worthless now, right? It is worth pennies, versus what it used to be.

So it’s like many projects in the in the web three economy where, because there’s no regulation, there’s no insurance, there’s no protection of any kind, when it goes belly up, it goes belly up hard.

And because all these systems are interdependent on each other, when the bigger market crashes, everything kind of falls apart.

And NFT is a part of that.

I still maintain that had the engineering behind NF T’s from the start been able to just use good old fashioned regular money, the market probably would have been okay, right? The idea of buying digital assets is not new, right? If you’ve been playing say World of Warcraft, you’ve been able to buy a digital asset, like an in game character or a hat or something like that, for real money, and you get to wear the hat and the characters you wander around, you’ll be eating up dragons.

That’s not any different than what an NFT is, right? It’s a digital thing that you can buy with, in this case, you know, a convoluted purchase process instead of saying, hey, put 10 bucks in here and you get a digital hat.

And I think the market would have been okay, if it had done that instead of the crazy infrastructure that has.

So you’re right, that this was a year of rapid collapse in the web three market.

And it’s unclear whether that market will, will recover to the heights that it was, I think the underlying technologies are still reasonably sound Aetherium had its big switch this year, from proof of work to proof of stake, which is a huge energy saver.

But I think now we get we go into crypto winter, it’s kind of like you know, you have the you have that initial burst of enthusiasm, you have a long dip a long trough and then once people figure out how to actually make the thing practical and useful and and all the snake oil salesmen have moved on to the next thing, then you’re like, oh, this will be the thing.

It’s like how like podcasting.

podcasting was huge in 2006 went quiet for 10 years.

And then finally people like oh, I can actually use this thing.

And we now see podcasting being a sustained sustainable technology.

Katie Robbert 14:21

You brought up some another not flash in the pan, but something that everybody was talking about and then stopped which is web three, you know, again, still exists still around people still trying to figure out how to use it, but the you know, the amount of conversation about these things has just died down as as the shine wears off.

And I’m personally interested to see what the next few things are.

What What I always find interesting is whatever seems to be trending at that time.

People will change Their whole persona around, they will change their, you know, social media handles their bios, the, you know, topics of conversation all around that one thing, so that they can be in on the conversation.

And then the second that thing is no longer cool or trendy.

Oh, that wasn’t me.

You know, and I think this sort of brings up the the portion of our conversation around sort of, where do you want? And I mean, the general you, but also you, Chris, where do you want to be in the adoption of that technology on the bell curve? Do you want to be an early adopter? Do you want to be somewhere in the middle? Or do you want to be a laggard? Because when you think about technological innovation, you have to fall into one of those categories? If you’re a laggard, usually like me, I admittedly tend to fall into that category.

It’s okay, this thing has been around for a while people have already kicked the tires and tested it.

Now I know what to do with it.

I fall into that category, I would say, Chris, you tend to fall into the early adopter category, provided you’re not sinking 1000s of dollars into a thing to test it out?

Christopher Penn 16:12

Yes, although I do have 150,000 narrative tokens, if anyone would like them, they’re worth $0.

Well, exactly.

Thankfully, I’m spending the actual money on them.

I like to test things early to see what’s possible.

When somebody buys you a new kitchen appliance, you’re like, oh, cool, I’m gonna try to see if I can use this thing.


What does it do? How does it work? What what are the possibilities? And to me, that’s the exciting part of a lot of these technologies to see what’s, what the technology can do.

And then the, the important part for a lot of us and this is, you know, something I rely on you very heavily for is the so what, okay, like, Okay, this thing works.

And we can see what’s theoretically possible.

So what how does this play into what you know, what people are willing to pay money for? I was doing some experiments over the weekend.

And I’m very pleased with how they’re turning out.

So my next step is to build some code to integrate an API into some of our tooling, is specifically OpenAI, as GPT language model into some of our tools, because I was doing some testing to see one of the things that Trust Insights does as we do predictive forecasting of search stuff, we will say, like, here’s a content calendar, right for your next three months, week by week, these are the five topics that are going to trend in search.

And one of the challenges we’ve seen, including ourselves, to be perfectly honest, is we don’t always use it.

Right? We don’t always use it really well.

But what I was playing with over the weekend was okay, can I take these five topics, feed them is a prompt to GPT-3 and say, give me five blog titles and five blog summaries based on or give me 10 Or give me however many taking the data one step further, one step closer to action.

So that instead of saying, here’s the five keywords you need to focus on, I can hand that to a content manager saying these are the 10 blog posts.

You need to write this this weekend here are the titles start writing, or here’s a synopsis, right? Here’s your here’s your your basic outline, start writing that.

And then logical next step after that is to say okay, well, if you want to pay a lot of money to us, we will have the machines do it for you.

And then use get first drafts back of the thing, but that when we talk about early adoption technology, the early adoption was does this model even work? Right? Does it produce something other than word salad and now that every every marketing influencer and their cousin is talking about the chat GPT interface and fun things you can do with like, they’re, they’re now just getting to the party trick phase.

And we are now which is where I want to be, which is let’s, let’s make this something useful.

And, you know, Clay Shirky said something years ago, which has always stuck with me, a tool becomes societally interesting once it becomes technologically boring, right.

And, for us, for me, in particular, the large language models are now boring, right? Yes, it’s cool the things they can do, but it’s like okay, I’m not wowed by it anymore.

I understand what it can and can’t do.

So now let’s make it societally interesting, because societally interesting, is when people will pay you money for it.

Katie Robbert 19:33

Well, you know, it’s funny.

Even if I myself am not using the thing that everybody’s talking about, I still do my best to pay attention to the conversation just to see what what people are saying that even exists, and where you rely on me to figure out the so what I rely on you to know what’s coming.

I’ve been hearing you talk about GPT-2 He for a very long time.

And by that I mean in technology years, like at least 18 months, probably longer.

I’ve been hearing you talk about natural language processing for as long as I’ve known you, which is coming up on eight years.

And so to me when I see this, I’m not.

And I think maybe this is why I feel comfortable being a laggard is because to me, it’s not new.

It’s not shiny, I’ve been hearing about it for a while from you, the early adopter.

And so now I’m in the, I’m truly in the so what phase like, great, you can make a bunch of fun, you know, medieval images out of your portrait as you’re giving away all of your personally identifying information.

That’s not a service that I think Trust Insights needs to offer.

So I’m not going to spend too much time worrying about it.

And so you know, it is I do find it fascinating when I see these things trending and coming up.

And then I look at my immediate, trusted circle, I’m like, you’ve been talking about this for years, this isn’t new.

And so I do like that.

That’s what I find really interesting.

And I appreciate your willingness to be an early adopter.

And that because it’s, you know, I know for you, it’s so much is sort of just fun, pure joy, entertaining, just like what can the thing do, I like to, I like to push the buttons, I like to poke the holes, I like to break it and rebuild it.

And then you hand it to me and go, I broke this, fix it.

Got some duct tape.

Christopher Penn 21:35

But that’s an interesting strategic concept.

If you think about it, right? If you have a mix of folks in your leadership team, and the early adopters way out in front, by the time at the laggards catch up compared to the rest of the market, the laggard in that company is still ahead of the mainstream laggards.

So you have that arbitrage of time.

But I think, for anything, as we’re talking years in review, or forecasts and trends, if you have that advantage, you have that time arbitrage that is a strategic asset that you can use as a company.

Because if your next competitor is if they’re early adopter is your laggard, they’ve got a while to catch up.

They’ve got you’ve got some room runway.

Katie Robbert 22:25

And, you know, it’s, I like the way that you’re positioning them.

Because you know, it was funny, as you were talking about, OpenAI and drafting the blogs and the summaries, that’s something that we’ve been doing on our own website.

But also, you know, going back to the conversation about growth moving into next year, that’s exactly the process that we’ll be doing with our content writers is, here’s the predictive forecast, here’s the key word, here’s the key, here’s the topic and the summary, go write the thing.

And it’s going to ideally, save a lot of time in terms of the writer’s output.

And, you know, I’m excited for that process to start because I feel like the amount of good content that we can put out, we’re just you and I just physically don’t have the time to do it.

And so having other people who can write, the way we want it to be written on our behalf, is going to be huge, you still need that human eye toward what’s good quality content.

So as we’re starting to think about sort of, you know, what’s trending up? What’s Trending down? Chris, what is something that because I see this question all the time, sort of the what’s old is new again.

And what do you think is something that is old, you know, put in big, fat quotation marks, what is old that people are gonna think is new again, moving into next year?

Christopher Penn 23:58

They will, you will see, I think, a backlash against a lot of the gender to AI capabilities.

Kurt and I were joking about this, on the live stream this year, the idea of like, organic grass fed content, right, that, you know, human certified content, stuff that you can say is, is an ad advantage because you it’s purely generated by humans, it has human judgment and things.

So in the same way that you saw artisanal stuff crop up as a reaction to mainstream manufactured things.

And, you know, farm to table as a reaction to, you know, to industrialized agriculture, I think you will see some of that same cycle.

With the generated generative AI, particularly, once people get an outside of you, once people get after the party trick phase, they will start to realize what the limitations of the models are, they will start to realize, oh, there’s some things it’s really not good at You know, the more specific you are, the less well the models perform without fine tuning, I was talking to my martial arts teacher about this weekend, I was showing him an example of how OpenAI can clean up a lot of text, which is it’s really good at.

But there are some things if it has no domain knowledge about at all, it doesn’t know what to do.

I fed it the text description of a particular Japanese martial arts Kata from the 14th century.

And it produced word salad again, because it’s like I, what, what does this even mean? It’s just not good that we were playing with some very arcane concepts from an offshoot esoteric branch of Buddhism.

And again, machines like, it can tell you the advantages of meditation and very generic terms, but it can’t tell you about the specific thing from this tradition, that core it has these things, it’s like, I have no idea what this is.

So as, as people start to become more comfortable with technology, they’ll start to realize its limitations.

And the the thing that leaders the early adopters have to contend with, then is to say, Okay, well, how do we get to the sowhat phase faster, so that we can get out of that trough and onto that plane of productivity.

And that’s, that’s going to be the big thing in the next couple of years is companies that figure that out fast, they’re gonna get across that trough, and, and, and have no shortage of customers and revenue?

Katie Robbert 26:28

That’s right.

I agree with that.

I’ve been saying this to anyone who asked me this question, the thing that’s old, that will be new and shiny, again, in my opinion, is Voice of Customer programs, between data privacy, and the implosion of, you know, public community based social media channels, companies that do not have good mechanisms for gathering feedback from their audience, prospects, customers, former customers are going to struggle.

And companies that already have those mechanisms in place, will be great, they’ll be doing fine, they’re going to, you know, leapfrog ahead of their competitors.

Because so many companies rely on social listening.

Now, I’m not knocking social listening, I think that there’s value to it.

I think that companies that are relying on primary, one of the big three big four social media channels to do their social listening will struggle.

So if you’re relying on Twitter, on Facebook, on Instagram, you’re going to struggle with your voice of customer feedback.

If you’re not currently talking to your customers on a regular basis, even if it’s just as simple.

Hey, how did we do, hey, can you take 30 seconds to take this survey, I see, I feel strongly that you’re going to struggle, because people want to be heard.

And if you’re not giving them the space, to tell you what they think you’re doing right or wrong, you’re not going to keep them as customers.

Sure, nobody wants to sit and wade through all the negative feedback.

But it’s part of the process, it’s the only way that you can improve.

And if you are actively ignoring, you know, negative feedback from your customers, and just not giving them a way to reach out to you, it’s going to be a problem.

So I feel like Voice of Customer programs, oh, I had this great new idea.

Let’s talk to our customers, I that’s going to be something that is trending in some way shape, or form in 2023, what people call it, they’re probably going to, you know, do the marketing thing and come up with you know, goofy acronym names for it.

But it at the end of the day, I think talking to your customers talking to actual humans, not relying on Chatbots on machines and social media to do the work for you is going to be a big deal.

And some companies will struggle to figure it out.

Christopher Penn 29:08

I think that you’ve you’re you stumbled onto something there that is going to radically change the customer experience for the first companies that figure it out.

So I’m gonna double down on what you said and say if you are not doing focus groups and one on one detailed interviews, we’re doomed.

You’re doomed.

I’m gonna say right now, here’s why.

If you understand these large language models and the fine tuning process and how you create prompts and responses to train models, and you have a large database of customer interactions, where you better structured properly done market research, you can train one of these large language models to be a synthetic customer.

Right if you have dozens of interviews, long interview 30 minutes an hour of talking to real customers.

or you can create essentially a synthetic customer chat bot that you can then ask questions to, and get trained tuned answers out of right? Can you imagine, you know, taking three headlines that you’re thinking about for a customer email, and asking a synthetic gene, hey, which one do you like best? And based on the data that you’ve trained and tuned, have a large language model on, it can give you a probabilistic valid answer.

Can’t do that if you don’t have the voice of the customer data.

So Katie, I think voice of the customer is something that people should double or triple down on, because you will need that raw data to make the synthetic cost to build the synthetic customer.

Katie Robbert 30:45

I completely agree with that.

And it sort of goes to that larger conversation around machine learning and artificial intelligence that we always have is it starts with humans, the machine does not just, you know, magically create the data, the data has to come from what we give them.

And so if you’re looking to introduce this into your organization in 2023, or even enhance what you already have, go back to your foundation, which is the people which is your process, and make sure that those things are solid that your foundation is unshakable for when the earthquake of I mean, gosh, who I can’t even I don’t even want to venture a guess, of what the heck is going to happen next.

Mostly because I hate putting things out there in the ether and sort of having karma come back on me.

But you know, if, if we take the very, you know, realistic example of this chat GPT.

Whatever is going on with artificial intelligence right now.

Yeah, it’s fun to play with.

But Chris, to your point.

So what we’re the company is going to do with it, use that to give it data to work with and right now, people are just giving their, you know, their headshots, which isn’t a whole lot.

Christopher Penn 32:07

It’s unstructured right now.

But the idea of the synthetic customer, I think, is one that I’ve not heard anyone talk about at all.

So you’re hearing it first, on the Trust Insights podcast, we should probably put up a landing page about this.

But I think that, particularly since we know data, privacy is going to be an issue if you are taking trained responses.

This is the question, this is the answer.

You will be able to create a synthetic customer that you can ask all these questions to not violate anyone’s privacy and get real intelligent answers from even something as simple as Katie, what you do every day in the analytics for marketers community, asking a question of the day, guess what that goes into? Molly? Here’s the question.

Here’s the responses.

Here’s the question, here’s the responses that can train a large language model to be tuned to, and to create that synthetic customer.

So I think that’s a project for 2023, I think it will be one of the many things to look forward to.

I know, I’m certainly looking forward to a couple of weeks of downtime and have on my docket.

Version Three is out of date, really badly out of date.

So I think it’s time to spend the next couple of weeks dusting this off and quite end up rewriting it from the ground up again, because the field has changed so much.

Katie Robbert 33:26

What as as we wrap up 2022 For Trust Insights, what is one of your goals for the company for next year?

Christopher Penn 33:38

For next year, the big thing is, and you know, I’ve got on my docket to we need to get done by the end of January is to get everyone onto Google Analytics 4, like all reporting every application and basically tell everyone, this is the this is the way we’re doing it now.

Because in a few months, you don’t have a choice.

And wouldn’t you rather be ahead of the pack ahead of the competitors? Who are going to lag and then wonder why they can’t get any information out of their systems.

And so that’s one of those very basic things.

And the second thing is it’s been a while since we’ve built something net new, like something that is not just a tweak of an existing thing.

And so one of my personal goals for next year is to build something that is net new that has not been seen before.

That is really unique, and that will deliver value to the market.

Katie Robbert 34:38

Very cool.

I look forward to seeing whatever the heck that is about you.

For the company.

I feel like we’re on the cusp of really nailing down our messaging our offerings, and really, you know, Clara, Finding what the heck it is we do, like we know what we do our customers know what we do, but the outside world, still Trump still struggles to understand what we do.

So I feel like that will be something that is clarified.

And then for me, which, you know, leads to growth and all those other, you know, great goals that, you know, we who own companies like to have for me personally.

And I’m looking at my whiteboard right now, I feel like, one of my personal goals is to launch the five p workshop.

And, you know, I have all the pieces, I just need to get over my self doubt, and just put it together and put it out there and test it.

But I do feel like if I can do it, well, it can be a powerful tool for strategic planning for, you know, organizational behavior for, you know, introducing artificial intelligence, all the things that involve humans, which is literally everything.

Christopher Penn 36:07

It’s true, it’s true.

So let’s hope that 2020 has fewer global consequence curveballs to throw our way this

Katie Robbert 36:17

is why I don’t like to put that out there because it’s your Anyway, go ahead.

Christopher Penn 36:23

And in the meantime, we wish you and yours a safe and happy healthy holiday season however you just you choose to observe it.

And we will talk to you in January of 2023.

So stay safe everyone.

Oh yeah, forgot to remind folks if you if you are bored, or if you’re bored on the holidays, we won’t be there the whole time.

But you want to pop by and say hello and stuff or you have you have last minute questions before year end.

Stop on over to the free slack group TrustInsights.ai AI slash analytics for marketers.

Were you and over 3000 other marketers are probably drinking too much eggnog.

And wherever it is, you watch or listen to the show.

If there’s a channel you’d rather have it on.

Instead, go to trust insights.ai/ti podcast and you can find us on most other platforms.

And while you’re there and you’re inebriated on eggnog, please leave us a five star rating and review it helps share the show.

Thanks for tuning in, and we’ll talk to you next year.

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